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We were given this suggestion before, it’s not a bad idea but will require some time to implement as we’re not ready for group stage yet :)
It’s worth trying, even for Libertadores we could have 2 groups of 4 after the pre-round. Group stages mean more money and most important, more fun!
Cheers!
a group stage in CL would be great, even just with 6 existing nations. Currently we have 21 starters in CL (the pre-round included). Why don’t we implement a group stage (4 groups, each with 4 teams) instead of the “round of 16”. the first 2 teams of each group go to the quarterfinals. fixtures could be:
Pre-round: 83, 86
Goup matches: 92, 95, 101, 104, 110, 113
QF: Turns 119 / 122 etc.
What do you think?
HEader is a good Improvement!
Congratulations!
Stramazi
Have you checked out our most recent addition, headers? Maybe the teams are now using formations with wingers against you that were very unusual before. Another possibility is that other teams simply changed the way they played and are now beating your previously winner strategy. :)
Cheers!
Hey.
My team, Man Utd has lately a behaviour that i find very suspicious. I’ve been lost games against teams that are much weaker than mine. Since i used the same players and tatics that started the season (and i made some good results the first games) i don’t understand what’s happening. In this last games i cannot make more than 10 shoots per game. Any ideias on this?
you’re right, we can’t copy real life with just 9 skills ;)
i’m ok with the “heading” for headers. but what you mean with “in the air” is not to mix up with headings on the goal …
@Philipp: I know what you mean but in real life there are good keepers who are very good on their line but less in the air to catch headers and the opposite. In Belgium we have for example Stijn Stijnen (keeper of Club Brugge), a good keeper – very good on his goalline but a bitt less in the air.
I think we also need this difference in the game. But with the skill we have for keepers I think it’s difficult to make this realistic. I think using speed for shots and heading for headers is a good solution to realise this in the game. So I think this is the basic of a keeper in the game.
In reallife a GK needs also speed for headers, I know, but then you can’t realise the difference that there is in the game.
Let’s say that this speed is a part of the Keepingskill in the game. In real life there is nothing as a keepingskill.
I agree that a goallie maybe need other special skills for the situations you say.
thanks for considering our suggestions and making some changes!
sorry for bugging again, but i still don’t understand why a goalie needs a really different qualification for saving headers (than for shots) ?
If you have a 60-40 skill relation (keeping – speed) for shots, you still need speed (reaction time) for headings aswell, plus maybe a heading-defending skill (but which, in RL ??): 60-20-20 would be more reasonable.
If you’re looking for situations where goalies need special skills, we need to consider maybe these aswell:
- 1-on-1 situation (dribbling skill to avoid being played off)
- free kicks (heading skill for jumping & controll for positioning of the defenders)
- penalties ( …)
What do you think?
Following some users suggestions we now have a new formula for keepers defenses:
shots → 60% keeping and 40% speed
headers → 60% keeping and 40% header
Too many changes for one day, we know, but the game needed it ;)
Yes Rodrigo, this “all running together” should stop when we implement a better player marking logic.
@thorpedo: here’s what we have after my changes, in the international cup round we had 16 matches, 58 goals scored (3,625 per match)…from these 12 where headers (20,8%)…looks much better now :D
Cheers!
Sounds like a good suggestion guys, this 60% keeping and 40% secondary skill. I’ll seriously consider implementing it :)
Thanks!
I agree with Philipp. But heading, could be used as a second abililty, like the jumping on Football Manager. Speed should be important, too.
After the first match, besides the high number of heading goals, what I saw is that another thing has to be changed: the players have to start passing the ball to the wingers, ‘cause the ball is passed almost every time in the center. I don’t know if it happened only in the game I saw (I’ll watch more)
The other thing that needs change I hope that can happen with the individual tatics: the players have to stop running together to the same ball and start playing in sectors. This will force managers to stop putting every player at just one line in the center…
Gabriel, you said that you’re working to improve the player marking… is this improvement related to this “all running together”?
Cheers!
I don’t know why, but my team got back to normal in this season. Can it be explained?
And Javier, my attackers have good other stats, too, and the problem is that in the last season they suddenly stop scoring. In fact, my main attacker had been the top scorer in the season before. Did he forget how to score?
It happened with all attackers and only in official games. Ver strange!
Thank god it’s not happening anymore!!
I have some other things to say about the game’s dynamic , but I’ll open an other topic for that. The new heading ability deserves it!
I agree with Philipp. I meant the same but only posted a possible solution.
@ Philipp: I saw your post in the “header topic”. I wanted to make it more practical.
i don’t think “some keepers are better on defending shots rather than headers and vice-versa” !
there’s no big difference between saving a header and saving a shot – you need mostly the quality to save. It’s not like you need the hands for one type of shot and the feet to save the other type of ball (header) …
@thorpedo: your approach is close to what i suggested earlier http://www.rubysoccer.com/forums/1/topics/681
Let’s see what the increase of non-headerchances will do.
I suggest that keepers have a mainskill “keeping” and 2 second skills namely “speed” (because a GK has to be fast to the ground to save shots) and “heading”.
For shots a GK uses for example 60% "keeping"skill and 40% "speed"skill.
For headers a GK uses for example 60% "keeping"skill and 40% "heading"skill.
The percentages can be changed off course.
This sounds more logical to me then 2 mainskills. Allthough I understand what you mean.
i thought twice about the changes, and i’m not loving the idea that keepers need a special skill to save a header. That’s not like in real life. But in real life football you might need a higher ability in reactivity/speed and controll of the penalty area (specially to prevent some headers).
So i would keep savings mainly related to keeping ability, even for headers. But would define a 2nd (modest) skill as a support to save headings.
We understand that Dot, but after discussing that between us and with some co-workers who play the game we decided to make keepers use their Header attribute to defend headers. It makes sense if you think of it, some keepers are better on defending shots rather than headers and vice-versa, but most importantly, it is interesting for the game in the long term, when a new generation of players with different values on header skill will be out there. I will have the same problem as you, I have 2 keepers with 92 in keeping, and now 80 in header.
It’s unfair for some, fair for others, but exactly the same change for everybody, we hope you understand our intentions and how hard it is to find a balanced way to add such big features. I’m sure your keeper will still help you even with 80 in header ;)
Cheers!
Copied from Improvements topic, posted by Dot
“Hi!
I’m wondering if is really fair that the Keepers should user their Header attribute to keep headings. This is bad because any current regular atacker can be in the same level with all current keepers. Thinking in this line, Keepers should use their Shooting attribute to catch shoots… But not, Headings and Shootings are both attack moves and keepers should use only one attribute to cath them.
In my case, I have a 100 kpg keeper. But this means nothing to headings, because a 63 shotting youth can easily do headings with 80 HEA, and my keeper has the same 80 HEA to try to keep the ball.
This is really unfair. I hope that you, admins, get my point.
Thanks."
Sorry Philipp, I may have got you confused at some point! The relation between performance & formation continuity is something to be implemented in the future. Right now you can change your formation every match without any kind of penalty for doing that. When we add this feature I’ll make sure all your questions are answered in the game help.
Cheers!
@thorpedo: I agree with you, headers should not ruin the game. Now that we have had a few real matches with headers I know what I should change next. My first change will probably increase the number of non-header goals scored, the next step will try to reduce the number of shots during a match, this should take the number of goals scored to a reasonable level, and more balanced between headers and shots. The first change will be ready soon, the second demands a little more time. The role of the defenders when we have a high ball is dispute the ball with the attackers…the reason that doesn’t happen a lot right now is because we need to improve the player marking in the match logic, and we will. Lots of things going on with the match logic right now, we’re trying to catch up all the time we spent on other features and put some extra effort on matches.
@Philipp: that’s exactly what we have now, everybody has 80 in headers skill, without any improvement chance, while new players will have natural growth of heading skills.
Thanks for the feedback guys!
i have some questions regarding the corelation of the team performance & the formation continuity.
you meant if a manager sticks with 1 formation the team doesnt get worse; vice versa if you make changes on a formation the performance will suffer b/c of this.
on what conditions the team performance gets worse & in how (decrease of the average player’s skill level?) ?
a) Does the continuity depends on the type of matches (friendly, league, uefa, …)? If i have 3 different preset-setups (formations/positions), 1 for each type of matches, will this mean i get a penalty in a league match when i played a uefa match in the previous turn? Or will i receive a penalty just when i change certain things in the same competion type of matches?
Will the performance suffer (& how) if
b) i keep the formations & all positions but replace one or two player
c) i have different formations & positions in different match types (s. above)?
d) i change just 1 position, like position MLC+1 deleted, instead MRC-1
e) How often (matches) do i have to play with a certain setup till it’s not a penalty issue another and is saved as the new “default”?
f) How does the penalties work, like decreasing all players skill ~3 points?
my understanding …
formation: 352, 343, 442 …
positions: M+1&LC, D0&R, A-1&C …
First matches with headers in Italy (mediumticker): 38 goals for 10 matches. 25 of the 38 goals were headers. Headers do their work :-)
But they may not ruin the game. At the moment you can’t defend them. In real life the chance that a goal is a header is not 65% as it is now in the game.
I think in a certain period of time we need more fieldgoals then there are now. Let’s say 75% fieldgoals and 25% header goals.
To defend headers I maybe have a solution.
I think you also need to count the headers of the defenders in cornersituations and freekicks. It’s not only the keeper who has to defend headers in these situations. Nevertheless the influence of the keeper has to be bigger than the one of the defender.
This is also the situation in real life.
Cheers
Only new players.
And existing young players with potential left ? did they get new points or only new players will get them ?
Right! My 92 keeper will also suffer…in the other hand a new keeper with heading 90+ will make existing strikers headers not so useful ;)
I forgot to mention in the announcement post that it’s a little bit harder to make your header go towards the goal than a shot, but it’s also harder for the keeper to catch a good header. I’ll update the announcement.
Cheers!
Soon new strikers with heading 90+ will easily score headers against our old keepers who’ve reached their potential and have only 80 heading even if they have 99 keeping. Right ? :)
Headers are ready to go!
In about 1 hour you’ll see a new skill on your players: headers. This new skill will be used on high ball disputes and on headers towards the goal. Keepers will use this skill instead of keeping to defend a header. We were going to wait until the end of FastTicker season but then we realized it would be good to have this as soon as possible in the game.
For simplicity all existing players will have 80 in header skill, without chance of improving it. For new players the header skill will behave the same as the other skills. There is no easy way to add an attribute to existing players, that’s why we decided to give everybody the same value, sounds fair enough.
Match logic has obviously changed with this new skill, now any player in L or R sides tends to run with the ball rather than passing it. This will still be based on the passing frequency strategy you set up, but for wingers the frequency is a little less than what you set up so that they can make crosses into the opponent area. Header disputes can happen in any high ball, coming from goal kicks, free kicks, corner kicks or crosses. High balls can result in headers “shots”, header passes or the player who wins the header dispute will simply get the ball and run.
When a player improves the chance of improving a higher number of skills at once has increased, as now we have one more skill to improve. The game help will be soon update with the new values.
It’s only the first phase of the “header system” and your feedback is very important in order to improve that. We’re confident that this will open lots of new strategy possibilities. Let’s have some fun!
Thanks Carlos. Hope you change your mind and join us again. We are already taking care of the no scoring problem. Headers are ready to go and Danilo can now continue working on individual tactics. As I said before there is more to come on this subject as it has a high priority. I’m only waiting for FastTicker season to end before headers are applied, unless most of you prefer to have it now, it’s ok for me as well.
About being fired I hope people understand that it’s normal that you are fired at some point, specially when you manage a big team with great expectations. We feel it’s good for the game as managers of small teams know that they may have the chance to manage a big team if the manager is fired someday, while the managers of big teams who are fired will be able to start it all over again in a new challenge to their abilities. But again, if most of you feel we should change that somehow to make it harder to be fired or never be fired at all it’s fine. We may not agree with that, but our users’ opinion is very important to keep the RubySoccer growing.
Let’s take one step at once, we’ll deal with the no scoring problem first, we’d rather tie 5×5 than 0×0 :)
Well, I got fired.
13 seasons after picking Leixões, I won 4 leagues and two national cups against some of the most addicted players on Rubysoccer, my work colleagues :>, so I go away happy with what I’ve done. Someone took control of the team right away, and I don’t have the motivation to start again from zero, so…
Javier, I mentioned the shooting of those three players, but the other skills (dribble, control, speed) were above 80 in all cases.
To the developers, I hope you continue listening to everybody as you have been doing, and improving Rubysoccer. In my opinion, this “no scoring” problem is very sensitive.
Long live to Rubysoccer. Take care!