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True, but what if you get more or less points next season? The planning was kinda useless then :)
I dont remember who but someone said “what happens if a manager can’t login in the first 13 turns of the season?”
The game would distribute his points to the departments automatic.
This could easily be avoid if we have access to a prevision table of departments next year. I believe it isn’t hard to implement. This way managers could start planing their strategies for next season earlier, without the danger they cannot plan an entire season…
Berhan, dealing players is one of the most interesting parts of the game for many people, me included. As the market is now I understand Rui’s point, a developed team needs to find better players, and they should as they have the means for that (much hard work from their managers to do it). At this point you’ll only find a top player in the market if the manager selling is stupid or not a real person…
Comparing to the real life, if this was the situation Cristiano Ronaldo would never leave Sporting, no matter if there are teams willing to pay 15M or 94M for him… Sporting would have no use for 15M, Manchester would have no use for 94M…
Cheers
^^ who said that ? im not going to read through it to find it
“How about the buying selling is NOT handled by the manager but by the club agents/lawyers/whoever.”
That would make the game less fun for a lot of people.
On topic, I have an old 90 goalkeeper for sale for almost nothing.
Also, another investment entity could be born with that idea, media reach out mechanisms, that would aid you to get the masses behind such a move.
Some players would never want to play for club X, because of the club or because of the manager, the media investment entity would work to increase your moves of the players.
And looking at the current situation with the transfer mechanisms, I think this could be a good solution, because you can always get young/ok players from the transfer marked, but to get the experienced and great players you would have to work a bit harder than just showing some money..
/BK
What are you talking about, you can sell/buy players, maybe not the ones you want for the money you have/can offer but that has been the reality of all games of this type. How do you address the issue with offering x amount for a player, manager refuses, then he leaves, along comes a new manager and sells the player for half the money you offered and it’s deal done…Maybe cheating, maybe not..
So again Rui, do you want a realistic game or a fantasy game?
I am not saying that you shouldn’t be able to buy/sell, but saying that I wouldn’t care less if I couldn’t get a player form the transfer market, I’d manage anyway.
Now this made me thing about something else.
How about the buying selling is NOT handled by the manager but by the club agents/lawyers/whoever.
What you could have is (at start of season, when choosing investments):
- a list of great players (listed by pos, skill and team)
- check box with “Season top scorer”
- check box with “Season top defender/mid/goalie/striker” which is the highest average rating for those players.
and simply give the club mission to get that player. That is a game/deal between the clubs.
And if any of your players fall into that category, the club can tell you, that you have until the end of season to GET to pos X, if not, we have to sell this player. Perhaps your top player. Why?
Because the club economists think it’s better to cash in your 100 skilled shooter than letting you finish 8th-12th for 10 season and then he becomes too old to be sold.
SO you have a meta game about keeping your players, if you want to keep your best player, then you have to fulfill your season goal.
We do have goals for seasons but if we do not reach them – NOTHING happens!!
Why not? The management (club) should say, sorry but we simply have to sell, player X, to keep the economy floating.
That can be really fun thing really, to really get the player you want even if the manager would refuse to sell the player to you, then clubs could still make the move possible based on how you both manage with your duties.
/BK
why make the injuries last longer?
Why not make the “match fitness” lower, that is simply another variable trained by playing matches often and letting physios fix players after that, perhaps match readiness (physical shape) is better. The better the player is at this, the less the injury risk. People not paying attention to that area will not be able to play the players that very often. Also being good at that area will get players fitness quicker up to 100% stamina/fitness.
/BK
so how managers are we losing a day now ?
piss off filipe go manager another pre built team
you wont bring middlesborough up might as well stick to what you know. managing a team that already is built for success :)
i have never managed any other team in this game. you skip around like its musical chairs and you won ALL your shit with a pre built team
look at how well you did at newcastle LOL!!! fired
you managed the scum shameful
“Do we want a realistic game or we want a fantasy game, I think the question goes towards that kind of reasoning.”
Hi Berhan, this is other typical argument i saw in SS/MS times :)
Realistic? How many seasons do we play in 12 months? This is a game. And we just have to deal with the inflation, which i must say it was very realistic the way i see it
“If I can not buy one more player ever again in this game, I would still enjoy the game.”
Is it realistic? :) hummmm…
People stop play this kind of games if they cannot buy/sell players, not because other economic problems.
the fact is, i don’t need to manage my economy at the moment…
Those crazy high wages are very rare I believe, we have seen some recent ones but still… A manager that joins the game, puts his best players in transfer list for some symbolic prices and then never comes to the game again, you know what that is… Those players probably haven’t gone to the real cheater, but I bet he was one of the managers offering, no surprise those players gone with crazy wages, but as I said, a few cases caused by a bigger problem in my opinion…
haha, how will you trade them? The game mechanics do not allow swapping players.
This one ought to be interesting to watch.
/BK
Rui, no it is not as simple as you say “economy is what we managers make it to be”, it is a well known fact in these types of games that the economy is ALWAYS a big issue, no matter what the game/genre is.
Having a balanced well working economy in a multi-player environment is ALWAYS a big issue that needs to be addressed or the game will have issues keeping it’s players.
Do we want a realistic game or we want a fantasy game, I think the question goes towards that kind of reasoning.
If I can not buy one more player ever again in this game, I would still enjoy the game. And you can buy players, maybe not the top players at the moment but you can still do good deals. And right, what good is the money if you can not buy the players you want?
That issue can be solved not by rolling back to previous state but building more mechanisms that will force managers to really invest in a core first team, and not keep an army of superstars in the squad. If you don’t want to sell your players ust because you want 400M and people can offer only 40M, then the player will go on free transfer and the wages of 400k/week will be tried, but then if you have the budget for it, you can sign them.
Now, if the game had mechanisms that would trigger other players to demand as big wages as the guy signed from the free transfer, then you would have to think twice if you want to offer 400k/week for a great player and thus risking unsettling the first team. Then again if you didn’t have that kind of check, the wage of 400k won’t do anything else but costing the money, then you are not putting a whole solution, only half a solution.
We really need to see what’s coming an that is the insanely big wages offered on free players as no one will be able to pay several hundreds of millions that managers will ask for those.
BK
“I think we’re all in agreement that the changes to the economy were needed”
no Charles, we don’t.
the thing is, before the changes, you had to manage your economy. now, you don’t. one less interesting thing to do in RS
one thing i learned from ss/ms days is that there will always be people complaining about economy. it’s quite simple: the economy is what we managers make it to be. and i don’t know any other way to make it be fair.
there are cheaters? of course. but so what? deal with those you can, ignore all the others.
what’s the main goal to play a game like RS? i believe is to have fun. do we have more fun now? well, i don’t. now i put my team and that’s it. 5 minutes/day and i’m done. i even have time to read the forums these days hehehehe
well, i believe this new system won’t last longer, but, if it does, that’s ok i guess ;)
94 goalie, 23 yrs, available for trade with very good striker.
goalie name: Rufino Baus http://www.rubysoccer.com/game/player_info/346587
Gabriel, the economy changes are great, with adjusted player development you can take the game to the next level.
For the player development, make sure you have a solid model, so we do not end up with superstars roaming around.
Take under consideration the “star” element ManagerSim had, it was a nice feature.
Really think about the players as real people, do they like their state at the moment?
When not played for several games (if player thinks they deserve a regular team place), the morale could go down a lot and when reached a “break point” the player can stop developing, but perhaps perform great. Most people would stop analyzing here, I think you need to analyze further and see how does the manager handle this performance.
If the player is still ignored and not given what he thinks he deserves then, he should really be unhappy and so on.
If you manage to do this right, guys – it could really be awesome game.
I also have some other suggestions about the talent pool in any given game world. I think that should be directly related to the number of real managers playing the game. Keeping it closed like that you will assure the hardware value of the game world not being devalued by having too many of the same players/entity.
How does that work?
New star player will appear when an old star is gone from the system (taking his place).
Who should get this player then (initially, later on anyone with the right money will be able to buy of course)?
I think there needs to be internal lists of rankings for managers that are not visible on the page but read by the game engine to analyze who the best youth-developing manager is.
There could be points unlocked for doing different “mission”.
For example some managers will develop a lot of own players and then keep them the whole career in the club, that can be awarded.
Others will develop youths, then sell them for the economy alone, that could also be awarded but by different measures and rewards.
Some will bring back the player they sold (youth from own club) and let them finish their career in the mother club, that could be rewarded.
And so on. Many rewards unlocked when you do different things, all measurable.
Other things:
- when managers look at a player profile, the more managers look at the player , it should be measured, it could mean a a player is popular, then the player would more likely “grow” star status.
Things like measuring, what a manager does when he logs into the game first, last before logging out, most often, least often, then measure everything to find out what manager focuses on – this really should be kept secret and never told managers that is active though, or it will spoil the fun.
Augmented reality/geolocation aspect, we all are placed in different places around the world. It would be really cool if say you were watching a real life game, in say Barcelona. Then the game could (not too often though) give you perhaps an e-mail from the scout pointing to the possible star player in Barcelona team, that is “mysteriously” put on sale.
I know this is a “multi-player” game but I think it would benefit from considering it as a MMOG really, where you develop your skill-set by playing the way you play, game measuring your actions and triggering rewards after a set scenario is played and objective fulfilled, WITHOUT calling it mission and so on, all done in the background that is.
/BK
I’ll not say too much, I’m on vacations :-)
The scripts from Ulisses weren’t added just because, we simply trusted that those interested in that information would simply use the scripts and we focused on other things. I don’t mind including them in the future and I don’t think Danilo would mind either.
Now, about the whole player development system, I agree it is time for a re-design and that’s likely to be the next big thing to happen. Me and Danilo have worked on a new model but to be honest recently I have been thinking and having doubts that the changes are good enough. Anyway, I will discuss that with him when I’m back, but if you guys have good suggestions feel free to post them, as usual.
Cheers
Charles, maybe but I am sure people would want to try to spy/scout on players, it would generate money..
/BK
Definitely a way to generate revenue BK but considering the game is completely free now, i’m not so sure admins would want to implement it prior to the game going “gold” and being ready to become a paid subscription type of game. but in the event that that happens, i think the admins are clever enough to introduce that kind of pay system. :)
I agree with Filipe. Tehre is tactics and choices to make with the current model but right now, the choice of selling this season to purchase players this season is null since the market is dead.
In tehory though, once the markets pick up, we’ll see this as a viable option towards spending board points in a specific way. (selling players this year to pickup players this year)
You wont get 100% from transfers Berhan, the max you can get is 80%. but even then, why would you want the money if you cant buy better players? This sistem wont work without any benefit from making money, if you have no interest in money you dont need to sell…
Well, I think I mentioned this to the developers or the forums, I am not really sure, but here it goes.
The game would benefit from having paid service options (perhaps through an app), letting you scout a player and see what the maximum potential is.
Another “premium package” would allow you to chose what areas (on youths) to concentrate developing, so they develop the skills that is important for them.
I had a whole bunch of those suggestions, but if you haven’t seen those then those were private mails with the developers for a possible co-operation deal.
Well, a thing to consider anyway.
/BK
^^^
Darren Bartholomew played 27 friendlys, no improvement.
Paul Johnson played 15 games, no improvement.
Frazer Neal played 25 games, no improvement.
Steve Nightingale played 27 friendlys, he improved at game 27…????
They have played full 90 minutes, so why are they not improving.
They are all youth players, coaching 10
I doubt that money saved will be turned into points.
Next season, you’ll have whatever you have and according to the level you have either increase or decrease. I like this solution VERY MUCH.
Now trading is not necessary, and you still can do transfers and make money.
I made a mistake and thought that people will sell a player or two, got my budget to 300M+, the mission this season was to employ/buy, while next season I will try to get maximum back from transfers (100%) and have a lower transfer amount.
This adds strategy into economics (almost turn based, where one turn is 1 season). Se next season is sell only season…
I think this will work for many people..
/BK
The money I save this season turn into points for next season?
Vaughn,
Fast
Treinadores 10 Determines how often players improve
Fisioterapia 7 70% chance of reducing injured players recovery time by 1 turn, every turn
Olheiros 6 Scout searches can be made every 5 turns
Estádio 10 Penalty on visitor players’ skills (including old players): 3
Transfer budget bonus: 30%
Total wage limit 9 $1,721,522
Transfer Budget 10 $315,800,000
Money from players sold added to transfer budget 10 80%
Medium:
Treinadores 10 Determines how often players improve
Fisioterapia 6 60% chance of reducing injured players recovery time by 1 turn, every turn
Olheiros 5 Scout searches can be made every 6 turns
Estádio 10 Penalty on visitor players’ skills (including old players): 3
Transfer budget bonus: 30%
Total wage limit 7 $1,374,934
Transfer Budget 10 $287,300,000
Money from players sold added to transfer budget 10 80%
finding the balance then so far its lopsided towards not good enough :)
and yes im saying impliment that script into the game so we dont need programs but we can keep track of it ingame then
@Davison: Cool i understand what you mean, but just to be clear, i dont manipulate the excel file, its just a dumping ground for me to keep track of a players starting average and stats :)
(lets agree that the players starting value doesnt mean shit necessarily)
also, if what you propose is implemented, won’t it take away a bit from what this game and managersim before it is? Won’t it just become a simple boring game about how long it takes for you to make your player reach the next level? Won’t it take the fun out of knowing if that player of your will actually hit his full potential? Won’t you find it boring to know exactly when a player is done growing for that particular season? This is something that is along the lines of “active” vs “passive” managers in my opinion.
Do you have ulysses script installed by the way Marc? It’s a great tool which’ll allow you to track how often your player stats go up… this tool is indispensable to me so i can keep track of a player who has grown during the season. if you say “i dont want a 3rd party script ruining the game for me” well then this is what you are suggesting (regarding keeping track of player XP). Actually, if the admins embed ulysses script within the game, it would actually make me happy (no more need for the script itself) and it would also curb some of your demands in a way that it would allow you to see if a player has stopped growing during that season…
if admins can respond to this question: is there a reason why ulysses script was never implemented in the game?
@Vaughn: ya it might be :/