This is a big feature so I thought it would be better to discuss it here instead of using the Improvements Discussions topic.

As a reply to the last comment there I would say I agree there are too many old players in the national teams, but that’s just because these are usually 100% developed, which makes them better. In the future we can have national squads for under-23 or under-20 players.

Here are the average ages for the last (real life) world cup teams:

from youngest to oldest.

Ghana – 24.1
North Korea – 24.8
Germany – 25.0
Cameroon – 25.2
Spain – 25.9
Chile – 25.9
Serbia – 26.0
Slovakia – 26.1
Switzerland – 26.7
Ivory Coast – 26.7
Uruguay – 26.7
Slovenia – 26.7
South Africa – 26.9
USA – 26.9
Mexico – 27.1
Argentina – 27.1
South Korea – 27.1
Algeria – 27.2
New Zealand – 27.3
France – 27.4
Greece – 27.7
Nigeria – 27.7
Denmark – 27.7
Netherlands – 27.7
Portugal – 27.7
Japan – 27.8
Honduras – 28.1
Paraguay – 28.1
Italy – 28.2
Australia – 28.4
Brazil – 28.6
England – 28.7

I don’t know how closely you want to have Ruby follow real life… where players peak around 27 or so. I do like the way the game flows now. But the older players probably should “age” harder.

Love the National team concept! Thanks for adding it!!!

You are welcome :-)

Here is the average on FastTicker:

Argentina 29.4783
Brazil 31.5652
Chile 31.9565
England 33.9130
France 29.4783
Germany 31.8696
Greece 32.3913
Italy 33.7391
Netherlands 33.1739
Paraguay 31.0000
Portugal 29.6522
Russia 29.4348
Spain 33.4783
Turkey 31.8261
Uruguay 32.6522

You may have a point here, players could age harder…or maybe automatic national team selection should take in consideration that old players are more likely to get injured and apply some kind of “penalty” when comparing them to the younger ones.

Wait a minute, I think there is a good reason why national teams have mostly old players. Remember we have changed the player evolution system several seasons ago? It is now making a difference and top players are harder to find. The old players are from the previous generation, where they were more likely to become stars.

Let’s see what happens when all these old fellows retire.

FastTicker teams with most players in national squads:

Tigre 10
Real Sporting de Gijón 8
Eintracht Frankfurt 6
Fenerbahçe 5
Liverpool 5

MediumTicker teams with most players in national squads:

Nancy 6
Villarreal 6
Inter 5
Bayer Leverkusen 5
Peñarol 5
San Martin Tucuman 5
Boca Juniors 5
Rangers de Talca 5
Hertha BSC Berlin 5
Rennes 5

Another statistic: here is the ranking of teams in real life, based on results:

1 Spain 1883
2 Netherlands 1659
3 Brazil 1524
4 Germany 1464
5 Argentina 1288
6 Uruguay 1152
7 England 1125
8 Portugal 1062
9 Egypt 1053
10 Chile 988

I suspect the rankings on Fastticker (based on player averages) are much different: Brazil is probably first (weakest player 88 average), Netherlands much lower (strongest player 87 average). As Dutchman I must object of course ;)

Cesário, tem como colocar a “TAG” de National Team Player em cada jogador convocado para podermos identificar?

Gostei muito das seleções, bem legal.

E o Tigre só prova ainda mais sua supremacia, não só na argentina, como no mundo inteiro.

Hehehe.

Abraço.

Já está nos planos…

abraço

I noticed the players are chosen by player value. I recently bought a good young player (Martinez) for 50M in fastticker. I found him in the national team of France. Normal since he has a player value 51M but is this his real player value or is it affected by the transfer.
Can for example a player with normally a player value of 15M who is sold for 40M be selected in the national team because of this transfer? His player value will be 40M after the transfer and will adapt slowly.

Great addition! But please add an icon to players profile and the (club) team players page asap. And maybe the clubs on the nat team players page next to the names.
I agree, the nat teams shouldn’t selected by $value, but by skills (for each position and the prefered system of the nat team). e.g. this one is in FT Germany’s goalie: http://www.rubysoccer.com/game/player_info/57795.
Clubs should receive cash for their international players when they play EC or WC – and the merchandising etc should increase a lot. In reference to that the “stars” from ssim will be good next enhancement.
.
thanks, mates!

National players are not selected by their values but by their average skill formula, which happens to be the same used for value calculation, hence the coincidence.

We’re in the process of providing a suitable icon indicating a player is currently in the national team in the team players page. I guess we could use the same in the player’s info page.

You’re right about the economic aspects, Phillip, but I’m afraid we’ll have to put that on hold for now to avoid an over inflation.

I’ll soon write about our ideas for managing national teams.

Ok, here we go. Our idea is that managing a national team is good stuff, but may not be as much fun right now as managing a club. We are designing things in a way that makes managers want to try to get a national team, but we also want to make it harder for someone to stay there for a long time. That’s what we have planned so far:

- any manager will be able to apply for a national team as they would do for a club
- applications will be evaluated periodically, not every turn, so that more managers can apply to the national teams
- manager ranking will be used when evaluating applications, but those from managers managing a club in the same country as the national team will have a bonus
- when accepted in a national team the club you managed will be put on hold for 1 season, meaning nobody will be able to apply for a job there during this period but the club will be managed by the cpu
- at any moment you can let go of your old club to dedicate exclusively to the national team or the other way around; if you don’t do anything after 1 season your club will become available for anybody to apply
- if you return to your club your performance there will be reset to 50%
- manager performance will change more abruptly (for good or bad) when you manage a national team and even friendlies will be considered
- manager performance will drop more abruptly if you have a negative result managing a national team and hasn’t let go of your old club
- you will be fired from the national team if your performance reaches 0%, no matter what

I guess that’s it. What do you guys think?

Cheers!

wow… two days and no one has anything to say???

Why should my club team go to CPU if I am managing the national team???

I disagree with this entirely!

I do agree that the national team managers should be spread around.

Will World Cup be every 4 seasons???

I would like to see all managers changed after every world cup.

Every manager must take at least one year “off” from ANY national team after being replaced/fired.

I would like to see 4 managers replaced at a national team, before a manager can be “reinstated” as manager there. So, if I manage Chile… I cannot return to manage Chile until 4 other managers have been there.

I might like to have an assistant manager of my choosing to assist me if possible. For help with tactics or player selection.

I have not fully considered these things (as I never really thought about being national team manager)… so… let me think about it some more.

I agree with not evaluating national team manager every turn.

I think it should be done every two seasons… at the end of the World Cup (when all managers are released), and the European Cup/Copa America. That gives the manager a time frame, and a goal to achieve. Managers are “fired” after every World Cup. Managers should stay if doing well after European Cup/Copa America… if not doing well, they are replaced prior to the World Cup qualifications.

In between cups… I think national team managers should be fired only for inactivity. (or they may resign)

I think at least half the national team managers should be replaced in between World cups.

So, if you don’t make the semi-finals in European Cup/ Copa America… you’re out.

If wanna be real tough in between… need to make the finals.

Yeah..the silence made me think everybody agreed, which would be weird :-D

CPU managing the club when you leave for a national team: it will work as a holiday mode, they won’t buy/sell/loan players, contracts will be renewed and youths hired (if possible), the only difference from holiday mode is that cpu will make their own line-ups. In the beginning, we are not sure how fun it will be to manage a national team but we want to encourage people to try so we they can make suggestions and we can improve the concept. It is not possible to allow a manager to manage both his club and a national team without huge design changes, that’s why we are not considering this idea for now. The other option would be resigning from your club automatically when you’re accepted in a national team.

Competitions frequency: continental cups and the world cup will happen every season, without qualifying, while we don’t have enough teams for that. National team matches will happen every 6 turns, starting on turn 5. The schedule will be fixed on season start, friendlies first, then the continental competition (ending on turn 71), then friendlies again and finally the world cup (ending on turn 143).

Dave’s suggestions: I like the idea of not allowing a manager to join a national team right after leaving one, and also the idea of not allowing the return to the same national team before other managers were there.

Managers fired: besides inactivity and resignation, I like the idea of having managers fired at pre-determined moments. What about this, in the continental cups all managers that are disqualified by “weaker” teams are fired and in the world cup, all managers that are disqualified are fired (no matter against which team they were disqualified), meaning only the world cup winner would be able to continue in the national squad for the following season.

Cheers!

I’m afraid you will not get the top managers wanting to manage national teams if their club teams might be damaged while they are “away”. And I wouldn’t blame them.

I am a moderately successful manager, and for me, I still might hesitate to let my club go “CPU” while I manage the national team.

I would never expect top managers that have awesome teams for a long time (Philipp, Francois, Amac, Julio Cezar)… to just “let go” of those teams in any way. AND… THOSE are the managers I would most want to run the national teams! You see what I mean?

I like the World Cup (and Continental Cups) to occur every season. That does take some sting out of the CPU matter.

Yes, there are many fewer national teams right now… I see your point. No need to spread competitions over more than one season.

I believe NO National Team manager should EVER lose his club team without his permission…. while he/she is managing the National Team.

I am OK with the World Cup Winner remaining as National Team Manager for the next season. I do not think they should be able to stay more than 2 seasons… no matter how great they are… if you win with Brazil twice… great… now take a year off and move on!

OK.. back to your points:
1) CPU managing club team: if unavoidable, OK. But no manager loses his club team while on National Team duty. ever. (and would be nice if CPU managed the team well! )
2) competition frequency: yes… all National Team Cups contested within each season works well. for now. (but I would hope we outgrow it…)
3) Dave’s suggestions about managers leaving and being rehired… OK, we are in agreement! LOL
4) Managers fired at predetermined times… again, we agree. :)Bring on the National teams!!!! :)

OK.. back to your points:
1) CPU managing club team: if unavoidable, OK. But no manager loses his club team while on National Team duty. ever. (and would be nice if CPU managed the team well! )
2) competition frequency: yes… all National Team Cups contested within each season works well. for now. (but I would hope we outgrow it…)
3) Dave’s suggestions about managers leaving and being rehired… OK, we are in agreement! LOL
4) Managers fired at predetermined times… again, we agree. :)Bring on the National teams!!!! :)(when can I manage USA vs Mexico???!!!!) LOL

Wow! No idea as well…

Anyway, reading the last paragraph is enough :-)

So I think we agree it is not fair to lose your club to manage a national team, specially that being a temporary (1 or 2 seasons) thing. And we DO want the best managers in the national teams. I think we’ll stick with the cpu management thing and improve that as we go…but we won’t allow a manager to be fired from his clube while in the national team.

Can’t wait to add more countries as well!

Hi guys!
my two cents …
a) Being manager of a national team is great, but it’s not a full time job (at least in here). Therefore I would like to avoid seeing my club beeing CPUed in the meantime!
b) Everybody should have a fair chance to get nat coach. But manager with great credentials should be prefered (as in real life). It should be an extra becoming a nat coach, and not as easy as the driver seat for a club.
c) Nat teams that fulfill their competition goals (e.g. “qualify for WC” or “reach finals”) should not automatically fire their coach. They should keep him, if he agrees. For a max of 6 seasons (2 full cycles). Nat teams goals that fail their objectives hard, fire the coach instantly.
d) a nat manager should be able to select/assign at least 4 player (1 for each position), individually to the nat squad. That ensures that “special” needs & tactics of a manager can be supported.
e) Will EC and Copa be the qualification for WC? Or will all teams participate on WC anyway? My recommendation would be EC/Copa (year 1) as qualification for the WC (year 2). Afterwards one season break (year 3) for discussing the managers replacement or the like. Before starting with EC/Copa again (year 4).

My comments:

a) I’m inclined to allow a manager to have 2 jobs at the same time (club and national squad).

b) Anybody will be able to apply for the national team and the best will be selected. It will be similar to the logic when more than one manager is applying for a club, except that managers playing in the same country as the national team will have a “bonus” in the decision. And as I said before, managers will be selected at specific turns.

c) We can continue discussing that, our goal is to allow a reasonable number of good managers to be able to manage a national team at some point.

d) The players you see now in the national teams were automatically selected. Once a manager joins the team he will be able to change all of them. The logic is ready to be used and is as follows:
- your team will always have 23 players, 3 of them will be goalkeepers
- when replacing a player you will be given a list of the best players available to replace him in a way that allows you to compare their skills
- you won’t be able to pick ANY player in the game, only the best for each position…don’t worry, the list will be long enough
- if a player in the national squad retires he is automatically replaced

e) In the beginning all teams will join the WC, we have a small number of countries for any kind of qualifying. For the same reason all competitions will happen every season.

I’ve no problem with leaving your team to manage a national team… It is good for your reputation and a new challenge in the game… I kinda get bored if I stay to much time en the same team… Right now I’m just waiting for the Portuguese Nat team call to leave Guimarães :D

I agree with Dave, Ruby needs Mexico and USA,
In the same note, I also think that Colombia, Peru, Ecuador and Venezuela need to be added to even America out with Europe, it also needs teams from Asia, North Korea, South Korea, Japon, China ( People’s Republic of China). and from Africa. Angola, Cameroon, South Africa, Ghana, Nigeria, Ivory Coast. if these teams were added we would have a total of 32 teams and that will be a wounderfull World Cup.

If you are one of the best managers , you should be award to manage both teams, please dont let Cpus to be in charge of the best clubs, this is so wrong and unfair……
so, if you get a national team, you must do well or be fire so fast… only 3 managers should stay after the WC.
use this as a reward for good managers… and if you get fire, you should wait to be elegible to coach other (any) country.

When we´ll be ready to start??

salud.

as I expected… managers with long histories with very good teams are not very willing to let their clubs run on CPU.

Like Filipe, I tend to get bored with the same team after a while, and move around. So, I’m ok with letting my team be on CPU for a while.

If it going to be a huge headache to let the National team managers run their club teams also… then I’d like to just get started with National teams anyway… and letting the CPU run your club for a while is the price you pay for national team glory! :)

That way, we could begin to get any bugs worked out. And then do any needed game design changes to allow a manager to do club and country simultaneously (when you can get to it).

just my opinion…

gostei muito da idéia das seleções… vou dar umas opiniões para tentar ajudar que seja feita da melhor maneira possível esta parte das seleções.

1- eu ñ concordo em deixar o time para assumir uma seleção, eu ñ deixaria o Nancy por nada, vc deixar uma CPU comandar seu time tbém ñ acho legal, senão os melhores times vão estar sendo controlados por CPUs, tbém outro motivo que ñ me faria deixar o Nancy por uma temporada com a CPU, quem sabe eu até poderia fazer isto por experiência, mas eu faria isto uma vez só, eu concordo com a idéia de deixar o técnico com liberdade para comandar seu time e a seleção ao mesmo tempo.

2- quanto ao tempo que os técnicos vão permanecer no comando das seleções nacionais:
eu concordo com a ideia de que os 3 ou 4 primeiros colocados na competição disputada tenha o direito de ficar por mais 1 temporada no comando da seleção, ou seja, o técnico vai ficar 1 ou no maximo 2 temporadas no comando da seleção, após isto ele é demitido da seleção e só vai poder pegar uma outra seleção após uma temporada, pq digo isto, estou levando em conta que quem vai ter preferência em pegar as seleções vão ser os técnicos mais bem posicionados no ranking de técnicos, acho q poderia levar tbém em consideração o Hall da Fama junto com o ranking… sendo assim imagina que um técnico ficou uma temporada em uma seleção nacional e ñ ficou entre os 4 primeiros, logo foi mandado embora, ele saindo da seleção ele logo em seguida vai pegar uma outra, e o da outra pega a que vc estava comandando, logo fica um rodizio dos mesmos técnicos nas seleções, vc não permitindo que ele possa pegar uma logo na seqüência abre portas para outros managers pegarem tbém.

3- quanto a escalação das seleções:
assim, vc Gabriel disse que os jogadores vão ganhar pontos valiosos na seleção, não sei bem como vai ser feito estes pontos, tipo, sendo que os jogadores muito provavelmente irão ter chance de ir pra seleção são os jogadores que ja são mais velhos, ou seja, ja ñ evoluem mais, sendo assim acredito q eles irão ganhar pontos valiosos e podem chegar a evoluir um pouco mais alem do seu maximo, como se fosse um “maximo” a mais para um jogador q foi convocado, eu em particular gostei muito da idéia se for esta mesmo, isto até ajuda a melhorar o mercado de jogadores mais velhos.
Dai se for esta idéia ou mesmo q os pontos valiosos sejam para jogadores que ainda tem a evoluir isto vai acabar fazendo o atual técnico da seleção dar preferência em pegar os jogadores do seu time, para que eles evoluam mais rápido ou que evoluam o “maximo a mais” que a seleção iria dar para ele.
por isso acho q para que ñ haja problemas, prefiro que a CPU continue convocando os jogadores, pois se for ver, a CPU vai convocar os melhores sempre, a convocação seria muito parecida com a do técnico, provavelmente mudaria um ou outro jogador, isto se o técnico for justo na convocação e ñ de preferência para os jogadores do seu próprio time, q eu acho q vai acontecer com certeza.

I will soon translate to English my opinion.

In principle, I think everyone leagues with human managed teams are more interesting than leagues with mainly cpu managed teams. So I think it would be better if people are allowed to manage both a club and a national team. It happens in real life too (Advocaat, Hiddink), I don’t think there are big objections and it’s better for the game.